From: Bill Morrow (penzance_at_gate.net)
Date: Fri Oct 18 2002 - 12:09:15 EDT
I just received a response to an email i sent about 3:00AM to a customer
with some insight in this particular USA v. MS, et al.,
> The EULA is an interesting thing. The deal that MS works out with it's
> OEM's (including IBM) is that IBM has what's called a "per-processor"
> license with MS. This means that if IBM buys a million intel processors
> during a given year, then MS charges them for a million copies of Windows.
> Doesn't matter if some customers didn't want Windows or wanted a "naked"
> machine. So IBM can't give you a refund for the copy of Windows you didn't
> want with your new machine, because IBM pays for that copy of Windows
> whether you want it or not. These licenses have been challenged in the
> class action suit against MS as being anti-competitive. We'll see what
the
> courts say. The MS defense of these types of licenses is that they
prevent
> piracy by end users and oems. It's an interesting question.
this raises another question..
what about the "naked" cpu's that are sold all the time..
for desktop boxes and so forth..
i'm now wondering if there is a hidden M$ tax applied to these which is
keeping the cost artificially higher than i would normally pay..?
and i also wonder if IBM (or anyone else) could or would sell the hardware
without the cpu, leaving that little job to the end user and thus avoid
unjustly enriching M$..
<------------------------------->
Cordially, :-)
Bill Morrow
WEB page http://thinkpads.com
thinkpads.com Open Forum
http://www.afaonline.com:8080/webboard/$webb.exe/~2/login?
or go to thinkpads.com and link from there
E-Mail: bill at thinkpads dot com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mick McQuaid" <mcquaid_at_u.arizona.edu>
To: "Bill Morrow" <marrow_at_adelphia.net>
Cc: <thinkpad_at_cs.utk.edu>
Sent: Friday, October 18, 2002 11:22 AM
Subject: Re: buying a thinkpad without microsoft is NOT POSSIBLE from IBM
> An email from EmperorLinux tech support confirms
> that they can NOT get windows-free machines from
> any large vendors, including Dell, IBM, and Sony.
> They say they have fought for this, but only small
> manufacturers will do it. They also confirmed
> that this is the reason for the free dual-boot
> option.
>
> ... regarding a message from Bill Morrow on Oct 17:
> > my guess is they DID pay the M$ tax and its built in..
> > the premium is for them doing all the work tuning linux up on the X2x
series
> > or the T series..
> > their prices are a bit high for some of the hardware items..
> >
> > <------------------------------->
> > Cordially, :-)
> > Bill Morrow
> > WEB page http://thinkpads.com
> > thinkpads.com Open Forum
> > http://www.afaonline.com:8080/webboard/$webb.exe/~2/login?
> > or go to thinkpads.com and link from there
> > E-Mail: bill at thinkpads dot com
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Mick McQuaid" <mcquaid_at_u.arizona.edu>
> > To: "Bill Morrow" <marrow_at_adelphia.net>
> > Cc: "Julian" <jmw_at_ptolserv.com>; <thinkpad_at_cs.utk.edu>
> > Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2002 2:27 PM
> > Subject: Re: buying a thinkpad without microsoft is NOT POSSIBLE from
IBM
> >
> >
> > > What about this?
> > >
> > > http://www.emperorlinux.com/raven.html
> > >
> > > I am curious, of course, about whether this
> > > company paid the "Microsoft Tax" and built it in
> > > to their X30, or whether their premium just
> > > reflects value they add. This may not seem like
> > > an important distinction to my wallet, but it is
> > > to my sense of freedom from unregulated monopoly.
> > > I am also curious if anyone has any dealings with
> > > / opinions of this vendor.
> > >
> > > ... regarding a message from Bill Morrow on Oct 17:
> > > > i'm not sure..
> > > > i think that as a dealer i CAN NOT and they as a seller WILL NOT..
> > > >
> > > > i was thinking, while in bed this AM, what would happen if i peeled
the
> > > > license tab off the bottom of a new thinkpad and returned it for
credit
> > as i
> > > > do not agree to the EULA..?! :-)
> > > >
> > > > but i don't want to cause trouble between ibm and myself.. :-)
> > > >
> > > > so i think i'll ask my customer what the result was in the penalty
phase
> > of
> > > > USA vs. M$ upon which they were consultants...
> > > > <------------------------------->
> > > > Cordially, :-)
> > > > Bill Morrow
> > > > WEB page http://thinkpads.com
> > > > thinkpads.com Open Forum
> > > > http://www.afaonline.com:8080/webboard/$webb.exe/~2/login?
> > > > or go to thinkpads.com and link from there
> > > > E-Mail: bill at thinkpads dot com
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Julian" <jmw_at_ptolserv.com>
> > > > To: <thinkpad_at_cs.utk.edu>
> > > > Cc: <thinkpad_at_cs.utk.edu>
> > > > Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2002 4:15 AM
> > > > Subject: Re: buying a thinkpad without microsoft is NOT POSSIBLE
from
> > IBM
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, 16 Oct 2002 19:37:19 -0400, "Bill Morrow"
<penzance_at_gate.net>,
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Sadly i was wrong..
> > > > > IBM can NOT sell a thinkpad without an OS.. and M$ is the only OS
> > > > > available..
> > > > Surely, if it really is "can NOT" then that is a violation of the
DoJ
> > > > settlement? I assume you mean "will NOT" ;)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Julian Wald
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Mick McQuaid, mcquaid_at_u.arizona.edu
> > > 520-621-4074 office / voice mail
> > >
> >
> >
>
> --
> Mick McQuaid, mcquaid_at_u.arizona.edu
> 520-621-4074 office / voice mail
>
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