Re: [Thinkpad] VISTA S*CKS!

And again, the very first point I made was "it is unrealistic to expect a migratition from one OS to another and have all of your old software work" and I mean that for any OS be it Windows, *nix or OSX.
 
Having repeated that, there are solutions that can be explored for the old software: launch options, administration launching, and upgrades. Bruce said that he was opting not to upgrade the apps because it might cost a lot of cash and I've got no beef with that. The fact that Vista is more than just XP + Eye Candy is the reason why there's issues and those issues are often not Microsoft's fault;, its often the ISV's fault. Since it's easier to blame the OS, most people do that - and I'm even OK with that but I still maintain that it's an unrealistic expectation that you won't have any problems when you switch OS's... which is why I've recommended to ppl to get Vista with a new PC. And why I suggested the same thing for XP, when it first came out. Easier for all involved.
 
What I do have an issue with is when someone makes a carefree declaration that is proven to be bunk, like saying there's no difference in functionality between Office XP and Office 2007. I'm sorry, but that's a complete crap comment. Further, the three comments of mine that you're taking out of context were made about his stance on Office 2007 - not Vista.
 
By the way, in using the "term" M$, you're basically stating the fact that you're biased in one way or another. :)

Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 10:50:38 +0800From: bernardchan77@gmail.comTo: starfirect@hotmail.comSubject: Re: [Thinkpad] VISTA S*CKS!CC: scosgt@worldnet.att.net; shrinkwrap86@hotmail.com; thinkpad@stderr.orgHello, sorry, I feel compelled to jump in....I don't think Bruce is biased, much less he's misinformed, or 'blindly believe a first impression' --- he may use strong words occasionally (but not excessively so this time) and his post is actually quite a fair general representation of the same experiences of the people I know. In fact, what they said about Vista is a lot less complimentary than what Bruce did.Vista may offer more eye-candy than XP, but for an enduser there's not much of a compelling reason for shelving out money at this moment. The most important thing for me is that a particular piece of software works as intended, i.e. deliver the goods, at a price commensurate with its benefits. Big corporations have the money so cost is not a consideration, but for home users
  the cost/benefits consideration is just not convincing.
On 26/11/2007, Randy L Santossio <starfirect@hotmail.com> wrote:
Now, now, I never said that. I said you are promoting or harboring a moronic opinion. That could mean you're biased or misinformed or simply choose to blindly believe a first impression.None of that makes you a moron. > From: scosgt@worldnet.att.net> To: starfirect@hotmail.com; shrinkwrap86@hotmail.com ; thinkpad@stderr.org> Subject: Re: [Thinkpad] VISTA S*CKS!> Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 21:28:09 -0500> > OK< so I'm a moron. Bye> ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Randy L Santossio" < starfirect@hotmail.com>> To: "Bruce Markowitz" <scosgt@worldnet.att.net>; "Stuart Friedman"> < shrinkwrap86@hotmail.com>; <thinkpad@stderr.org>> Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2007 9:14 PM> Subject: Re: [Thinkpad] VISTA S*CKS!> > > > Uh, have you used it? I'm not being glib about it - it's an honest> question.> >> > The new UI beats the hell out of Office XP. Faster, on all of the> machines I've used it on. Whole new views for your data. The saved files> in 2007 are XML based - so more transferabl
 e - and much smaller which is a> nice to have. All of the themed controls of Word and PowerPoint allow for> really slick graphics work with one or two clicks, things that weren't> available to Office 2003, much less Office XP. Not to mention all of the> collaborative options and sharing stuff, when you store things in the cloud.> >> > Maybe you mean to say "there's no advantage that Office 2007 has that> means anything to me and I'm still happy with Office XP" but to say there's> no advantage between the two is... well, moronic. There are a ton of new> and innovative features between Office XP and 2007. I mean, you're entitled> to your opinion - you'll just be wrong.And what's with the M$ - I thought> that was only used by /. readers?> >> >> >> > > From: scosgt@worldnet.att.net> To: starfirect@hotmail.com;> shrinkwrap86@hotmail.com; thinkpad@stderr.org> Subject: Re: [Thinkpad] VISTA> S*CKS!> Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 20:45:21 -0500> > No NO, there is no> advantage to Office 200
 7 over Office 2K, just more money> for M$.> ----- > Original Message ----- > From: "Randy L Santossio" < starfirect@hotmail.com>>> To: "Bruce Markowitz" <scosgt@worldnet.att.net>; "Stuart Friedman">> < shrinkwrap86@hotmail.com>; <thinkpad@stderr.org>> Sent: Sunday, November> 25, 2007 8:37 PM> Subject: Re: [Thinkpad] VISTA S*CKS!> > > > A few things:>> >> > I'm not telling you to upgrade to Vista - I'm just pointing out that> a)> there are solutions to your problems if you want to upgrade, b) your>> expectations that all-things-will-work-on-a-new-OS is simply unrealistic,>> and c) your experience wasn't mine (since I'm running Vista on four>> machines - one of which is a T60p - with no trouble). I've seen apps break>> across something as small as 10.4.5 to 10.4.6 i> > n OSX - you went from 5.0.2> to 6.0 which is often a quantum leap between> OS versoins.> >> > And yes, SP1 and SP2 didn't come out in 2001, but the> core of the OS was> released in 2001. I don't care if SP9 of W
 indows 2000> comes out tomorrow -> it's still an 8 year old OS.> >> > Further, you can> use DOS 5.0, Windows 3.1, and Word for Windows 2.0 on> your T60 - Microsoft> isn't stopping you. The question I would have is how> productive or> effective will you be if you use it compare to XP and Office> 2000 or Vista> and Office 2007? And if you're more productive with an abacus> and slide> rule, good for you, but it doesn't mean that it's what the> majority of the> world will want :)> >> >> >> > > From: scosgt@worldnet.att.net> To:> starfirect@hotmail.com;> shrinkwrap86@hotmail.com ; thinkpad@stderr.org>> Subject: Re: [Thinkpad] VISTA> S*CKS!> Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007> 20:29:10 -0500> > Sure, but what does it DO> for me? (that XP does not)?>> And just for the record, XP Service Packs 1 and>> > 2 are MUCH newer than 2001> And there is supposedly a SP3 in the works.>>> Besides, if I pay M$ outrageous price for software (such as Office 2K) why>>> shouldn't I be able to use it until the n
 ext millenium if I want to?> ----- > > Original Message ----- > From: "Randy L Santossio"> < starfirect@hotmail.com>>> To: "Bruce Markowitz" <scosgt@worldnet.att.net>;> "Stuart Friedman">> < shrinkwrap86@hotmail.com>; <thinkpad@stderr.org>> Sent:> Sunday, November> 25, 2007 8:25 PM> Subject: Re: [Thinkpad] VISTA S*CKS!> >> > > I think it> comes down to expectations.> >> > You upgraded the OS from> something> originally built in 2001 to something> newly released in 2006 and> you> expected all of the applications to continue> > > to work without any> updates from their respective manufacturers? And> how> exactly is it> Microsoft's fault that other ISV's either want to charge> for> upgrades or> don't bother to fix their software?> >> > I'd call that> wholly unrealistic.> And I wouldn't attempt to run No> > rton> Navigator [for> Windows 95] on your new box.FWIW, I've installed> Vista over> XP and Office> 2003 continued to work - not sure what went on> there, but it's> worked for
> me. I recall seeing a fix for the USB thing> either on Lenovo's> site or via> a Vista patch. And for stuff that seems> unhappy in Vista, try> running it in> XP's compatibility mode (an option on> Properties on Shortcuts)> or r unning> it as Administrator. I can't tell you> how many software apps> I've seen that> attempt to write something to C:\ or> C:\Program Files -> that's just bad> coding by a Windows programmer.> > JM2C> of course. But along the same lines,> I have to laugh at this.> People> bitched and moaned that XP was old and they> wanted somethi> > ng new and>> shiny - then Vista comes around and people bitch and moan> that it's simply>> different. Ah well. Such is life.> >> >> >> > > From:>> scosgt@worldnet.att.net> To: scosgt@worldnet.att.net;>>> shrinkwrap86@hotmail.com ; thinkpad@stderr.org> Date: Sun,> > 25 Nov 2007>> 20:01:11 -0500> Subject: [Thinkpad] VISTA S*CKS!> > Well,> just to try it, I>> installed Vista Ultimate over an existing new> install> or IBM
 XP on a high>> end T60 (Duo 2 Ghz, 2GIG RAM, Hypermemory video>> card). The install went>> fine. I had to spend quite a bit of time updating>> drivers (video, power,>> USB, audio (which always errors out) and a few>> others. All w as up and>> running BUT> And here is the BIG BUT> Most of the> pre-Vista stuff DOES NOT>> WORK!> I could not open an Office Word .doc -> apparently it wants me to>> purchase> the new version of MS Office (DUH)>> AutoGK (makes .avi files)>> would not work, errors out> USB drives have to> be inserted twice, the first>> time it gives a driver> install error>> PowerDVD> > gives a compatibility error>> Now this machine did not have much> on it,> but what there was did not work!>> F*CK MicroSoft. I am not about to> buy> all> > new software so they can make> money.> XP is fine. I'm sticking> with>> it.> That's my ra> > nt and I'm sticking with it.> And not to mention, it> killed> my recovery> partition, so I had to re-install> from the CD's> I am> not a>
 conspiracy> nut, but is there anyone who thinks this is not>> deliberate?> >>> _______________________________________________> Thinkpad> mailing list>>> Thinkpad_at_stderr.org>> http://stderr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/thinkpad>> >> _______________________________________________> > Thinkpad mailing list>> >> Thinkpad_at_stderr.org> >> http://stderr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/thinkpad>> >> _______________________________________________> > Thinkpad mailing list> >> Thinkpad_at_stderr.org> > http://stderr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/thinkpad>> > _______________________________________________> > Thinkpad mailing list> > Thinkpad_at_stderr.org> > http://stderr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/thinkpad>_______________________________________________ Thinkpad mailing listThinkpad_at_stderr.orghttp://stderr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/thinkpad-- Kind regards,Bernard Chan
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Received on Sun Nov 25 22:17:14 2007